before they had had further discussion; | plementary Estimates came on, he and, therefore, he begged to move to should, therefore, recommend his hon. report Progress. Friend the Member for Mayo to withdraw his Motion. Motion made, and Question proposed, "That the Chairman do report Progress, and ask leave to sit again.". (Mr. O'Connor Power.) SIR HENRY SELWIN-IBBETSON really hoped that the hon. Member was not in earnest in making his Motion. They had now had what everyone must admit to be a most unprecedented discussion, lasting nearly six hours, on a single Vote of the Civil Service Estimates. Although he quite admitted the importance of the Vote, and the extreme importance of the subject that had been brought under consideration, he did hope that the Committee, having considered the matter at length, would now pass the Vote. He appealed to the hon. Member to be satisfied with the ampleness of the discussion, and to withdraw his Motion. MR. O'CONNOR POWER said, that, under the circumstances, he would beg leave to withdraw his Motion. He would, however, first ask the Chairman of Ways and Means, whether they would be in Order in raising the point suggested upon the Supplemental Estimates? THE CHAIRMAN said, that, not having the Supplemental Estimates before him, he could not inform the hon. Member what questions could be raised upon them. Motion by leave, withdrawn. Original Question put, and agreed to. (2.) Motion made, and Question proposed, be granted to Her Majesty, on account, for or "That a further sum, not exceeding £1,101,400, towards defraying the Charge for the following Civil Services and Revenue Departments for the year ending on the 31st day of March 1880, viz. : CIVIL SERVICES. INGS. MR. RYLANDS observed, that this Vote had been very carefully and fully discussed, and he thought that next year they would be able to discuss the subject still more fully and carefully. He CLASS I.-PUBLIC WORKS AND BUILDthought, also, that the exhaustive discussion that they had had would supply some very valuable hints to the Home Secretary in dealing with these questions; and, under the circumstances, he trusted that the hon. Member for Mayo would CLASS II.-SALARIES AND EXPENSES OF allow the Vote to pass, on the understanding that Progress would be immediately reported afterwards. MR. PARNELL remarked, that he had studied the case of Nolan very carefully, and but for having lost his voice would like to make some further observations with regard to it. Did he understand the right hon. Gentleman to say that there would be a Supplemental Estimate introduced for the Prisons that Session? MR. ASSHETON CROSS said, that it would be necessary to introduce a Supplemental Estimate for some purposes. As they had to provide compensation to some local gaols, it would be necessary to force the matter on in order to provide the requisite funds. MR. PARNELL said, that in that case, as there would be an opportunity for raising further discussion on a very important point-namely, the repeated infliction of the punishment of solitary confinement by gaolers, when the Sup Ireland :-- PUBLIC DEPARTMENTS. £ 12,000 Charitable Donations and Bequests Office Local Government Board Record Office £ 2,500 150 10,500 2,500 500 £ 17,000 22,000 4,000 200 150 600 1,200 CLASS VI.-SUPERANNUATION AND RETIRED ALLOWANCES, AND GRATUITIES FOR CHARITABLE AND OTHER PUR Motion made, and Question proposed, "That the Chairman do now leave the Chair."-(Mr. O' Connor Power.) SIR HENRY SELWIN-IBBETSON thought that the course he had taken had been assented to by hon. Members generally. It was arranged that they should be allowed to take a Vote on Account, in order to meet certain demands which it was absolutely necessary to satisfy before they separated for the Holidays. He pointed out that their only opportunity to get this Vote on Ac£ count was that evening, although he ad75,000 mitted that it was an unusual course to 2,500 take a Vote on Account on the same 2,600 night as the Civil Service Estimates. Had he not taken the Vote that evening, he should have had to prolong the Sitting till Thursday-thus shortening the Holiday. With that difficulty before him, he ventured on that occasion to take 20,000 3,000 MENT BILL-[BILL 33.] (Mr. Alexander Brown, Mr. Whitwell, Mr. Ryder.) the unusual course of asking for a Vote | PUBLIC HEALTH ACT (1875) AMENDon Account of the Civil Service that day before they separated. He had agreed to leave out of the Vote an Item which was objected to by several hon. Members below the Gangway oppositenamely, the University Vote for Scotland. That had been struck out of the sum demanded, and was not, therefore, included in the Vote just put from the Chair. MR. O'CONNOR POWER begged leave to withdraw his Motion. Motion, by leave, withdrawn. Original Question put, and agreed to. House resumed. Resolutions to be reported To-morrow, at Two of the clock; Committee to sit again To-morrow, at Two of the clock. EAST INDIA [LOAN]. Resolution [May 23] reported. SIR GEORGE CAMPBELL said, that the House was very much taken by surprise in having this matter brought ou at that period, as no notice whatever of the proposal to take it had been given. The Bill was not in the Paper that morning-no one knew what it meant. He had not the slightest idea that the House was to be committed to a loan of these £2,000,000, which he understood it was the proposal of this Bill to lend to India. THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER said, that the loan which they had heard mentioned was a loan of £2,000,000 by this country to India. He understood that it was the desire of the House to have the discussion upon this Bill taken in connection with the general question of Indian finance. There would be an opportunity at a later stage of the Bill of making any explanation with regard to it, and he hoped that the House would now consent to take the Report of the Committee upon it. Resolution agreed to. Bill ordered to be brought in by Mr. RAIKES, Mr. EDWARD STANHOPE, and Mr. CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER. Bill presented, and read the first time. [Bill 197.] COMMITTEE. [Progress 7th April.] Clauses 1 and 2 agreed to. Clause 3 (Powers of local authority for supply of water). MR. A. H. BROWN moved, in page 3, at end to add "Nothing in this section shall empower a local authority to obtain or supply water within the limits of a Water Company or of any local authority or person empowered by Act of Parliament, or any Provisional Order confirmed by Parliament to supply water, without the consent of such Water Company or local authority or person." Amendment agreed to. Clause, as amended, agreed to. MR. A. H. BROWN moved, in page 5, after Clause 4, to insert the following Clauses : (Supply of water by Water Company under guarantee of local authority.) "Where the district or any portion of the district of a local authority is situate within the limits of supply of any Water Company empowered by Act of Parliament or any Order confirmed by Parliament to supply water, and water therein on the terms prescribed by section the Company are under an obligation to supply thirty-five of The Waterworks Clauses Act, 1847,' and it appears to the local authority that the district or portion as the case may be ought to be supplied with water, and the Company as obtained from the owners or occupiers of houses to any part of that district or portion have not in that part, an agreement to the effect specified in that section, the following provisions shall have effect: "1. The local authority may, if they think "3. If the Company fail within those three | months to provide and lay down such pipes, or to construct such reservoir, if any, or to provide such supply of water as aforesaid, the part in respect of which the undertaking is given by the authority shall be excluded from the limits of supply of the Water Company; 4. Any undertaking given by a local authority under this section shall be binding on the authority and their successors, and any expenses or payments incurred or made by a local authority under this section shall be deemed to be expenses incurred by them in the execution of the provisions of The Public Health Act, 1875,' and shall be provided for accordingly; "5. This section shall apply to any local authority or person empowered to supply water within the district of another local authority or person as if the first-mentioned authority were a Water Company." He hoped that the House would allow these clauses to be inserted then, in order that they should be re-printed in the Bill. There would be plenty of time for the consideration of the matter at a later stage, when the Amendments would be incorporated into the print of the Bill. He was most anxious to do nothing which would injure the rights of Water Companies; but it would be a great convenience that the Bill as a whole should be re-printed, including these clauses. SIR HENRY HOLLAND moved to report Progress. The negotiations which the hon. Member had had with reference to these matters had signally failed, and he objected to these clauses being inserted. Motion made, and Question proposed, "That the Chairman do report Progress, and ask leave to sit again."-(Sir Henry Holland.) MR.A.H.BROWN said, that, of course, if anyone objected to the insertion of the clause, he could not insist. He might, however, point out, that as the Public Health Act did not apply to the Metropolis, so this clause did not apply at all to the Metropolis. Still, as there was an objection to the Bill being re-printed in the amended form, he would agree to report Progress. Motion agreed to. House resumed. Committee report Progress; to sit again upon Thursday 12th June. Mr. A. H. Brown able to call attention to-Whether the letters patent in the commission, which define the functions, powers, and jurisdiction of Sir Bartle Frere have been cancelled, or rather revoked, by Her Majesty's Government, in order to be issued in an amended form? Your Lordships will not forget that Sir Bartle Frere has hitherto held office, not only as Governor of the Cape, but has exercised jurisdiction over the Provinces of Natal and the Transvaal, and has exercised power as High Commissioner over the Native tribes in these particular districts. My Lords, I have no desire to raise any discussion on the subject; but, at the same time, I think it right to address myself to one point which appears to me to be of great im Ordered, That Standing Orders Nos. 92. and 93. be suspended; and that the time for deposit-portance. I have not a word to say ing petitions praying to be heard against Private and Provisional Order Confirmation Bills, which would otherwise expire during the adjournment of the House at Whitsuntide, be extended to the first day on which the House shall sit after the recess. against the appointment of Sir Garnet Wolseley. I have the highest opinion of him, both as a military man and a civil administrator; but I am extremely desirous that at this conjuncture Her Majesty's Government, while looking at the military aspect of affairs as a first consideration, should not close their eyes to what is almost of equal importancenamely, the civil government of those Provinces. If Sir Garnet Wolseley is called on to discharge military duties, as senior commanding officer, and take an active part in the campaign, it would be clearly impossible for him to give his attention to civil affairs. On the other hand, I think it would be very undesirable at this moment, if it could be avoided, to sparo from Natal the services of a Chief of the great experience, knowledge, and clear head of Sir Henry Bulwer, and I think it would be dangerous to leave the Transvaal to the administration of any mere local subordinate official, who might be without knowledge of the temper of the population or of the antecedents or requirements of the Province. I cannot, therefore, but hope that, while Sir Garnet Wolseley has been placed in the supreme command, Her Majesty's Government will pay earnest attention to the necessity of securing the services on the spot of able and experienced officers in the Transvaal, and, if possible, also in Natal. THE EARL OF CARNARVON: My Lords, I wish to put certain Questions to my noble Friend the Under Secretary of State for the Colonies, of which I have given him private Notice. I do not quite understand, from the explanations given last night by the noble Earl at the head of the Government, or from the statement reported as having been given by the Secretary of State in another place," what is the precise position of Sir Garnet Wolseley towards the Lieutenant Governor of Natal and the Administrator of Affairs in the Transvaal. I would, therefore, ask my noble Friend, in the first place, Whether Sir Henry Bulwer and Colonel Lanyon have been recalled or superseded, or whether they still retain their positions in South Africa? I wish, in the second place, to know, Whether the Colony of Natal and the Province of the Transvaal will be administered as a single Colony or State, and, if so, what EARL CADOGAN: My Lords, in reply place will be the seat of government? to the first Question of my noble Friend Thirdly, I wish to ask my noble Friend-namely, whether Sir Henry Bulwer -though this is a matter of less im- and Colonel Lanyon have been recalled portance, but still one which it is desir- or superseded—I have to say that they |