Arkwright, G. Hall, Col. Baillie, H. J. Baldock, E. H. Buck, L. W. Clive, hon. R. H. Cocks, T. S. Coles, H. B. Collins, T. Compton, H. C. Cunolly, T. Corry, rt. hon. H. L. Davies, D. A. S. Diedes, W. Dsraeli, B. Dod, J. W. Drumlanrig, Visct. Drummond, H. Duncombe, hon. W. E. Duncuft, J. Du Pre, C. G. Edwards, H. Egerton, W. T. Evelyn, W. J. Halle well, E. G. Keogh, W. Lennox, Lord A. G. Mahon, The O'Gorman Forester, hon. G. C. W. Pakington, Sir J. Freestun, Col. Freshfield, J. W. Fuller, A. E. Prime, R. Galway, Visct. Pugh, D. Gaskell, J. M. Richards, R. Gladstone, rt, hon.W. E. Roche, E. B. Goold, W. Sadleir, J. Grace, O. D. J. Sandars, G. Main Question, as amended, put, and agreed to. Bill to amend and consolidate the Laws respecting the Militia ordered. LORD JOHN RUSSELL: Sir, I consider that the Vote to which the House has just come, is tantamount to a refusal to allow the Government to bring in the Bill which they have prepared. It is a Bill for the internal defence of the country, and, as such, a Bill of the utmost importance to the country. I cannot, therefore, consent to assume the further responsibility of the Bill with an alteration in its title which I consider objectionable. I intend, therefore, to relieve myself of all further responsibility with regard to it, and shall leave it to the noble Lord, or any one else who wishes, to bring in the Bill. VISCOUNT PALMERSTON: Sir, I cannot help expressing my extreme surprise at such an abdication by the Government of their proper functions in this House. I presume, it was not without full deliberation that the Government deemed it to be their duty to introduce a measure for the better defence of the realm. The only difference of opinion between the majority of the House and the Government has been, whether that measure shall be founded upon the Act of the 42nd Geo. III. or the Act of the 58th Geo. III.-whether it shall be founded upon the system of a regular militia or of a local militia. The noble Lord has stated by his explanations this evening that his measure was so nearly the same as the arrangement of the regular militia, that it appeared to me-and it has also appeared to the majority of the House-that it was inconsistent with common sense, I may say, to retain the word "local" in a measure which, in fact, with one exception, was an arrangement similar to that of the regular militia. The noble Lord has admitted substitutes, which the Local Militia Act forbids, although we have indeed heard a very eloquent exposition of the objections to these substitutes. The noble Lord stated that his plan would admit of substitutes, like the regular militia; he stated that his plan putting the Government in a minority in would admit of the force being called out times of serious import, and with regard and embodied in case of war like the to a serious question, to show that a maregular militia; and he admitted if I jority of this House had not confidence understood the noble Lord rightly-that in the existing Administration. I must in case of war it might be sent to any part therefore, Sir, conclude by moving that of the United Kingdom, like the regular Mr. Bernal and Lord Viscount Palmerston militia. The only remaining difference be ordered to bring in the Bill. between us is as to the period during which the force so called out shall be liable to remain embodied; and I ask, if that is the case, is it fitting that the Government should shrink from the performance of their duty-that they should throw up, on account of a verbal incidental alteration of their plan, a measure which they ought not to have proposed unless they thought that it was really essential for the welfare of the country? MR. SPEAKER: I have to inform the House that at present there is no question before it. LORD JOHN RUSSELL: Sir, after what the noble Lord has said, it is incumbent on me to say a few words in explanation. The noble Lord says that the measure which I explained on a former occasion, and again this evening, was so nearly similar to the plan which he himself proposed for restoring and establishing the militia, that he wonders I should throw up the Bill. Now if that were the case, I own I should think it a most unprecedented course, that, because of some difference on minor points with regard to this Bill, therefore a majority of this House should alter the words of the title of this Bill, thereby implying that a very great change is intended. I am sure that if we were now to bring in the Bill on the principles of which the Government have decided, when that Bill was printed I should be told, that is not the Bill which the noble Lord intended, and other provisions must be introduced. Sir, is that a position for a Government to hold? I think I made a great admission when I said that, with regard to all the details of this Bill, when it was before the House, I should be ready to listen to any amendments; I should be ready even to submit it to a Select Committee for further consideration. But if I am to be stopped at the threshold-if I am to be told at the commencement that this House has no confidence in us then, Sir, it is impossible for us to go on with this measure [Cheers]. I hear hon. Gentlemen cheer that observation, thereby implying clearly that the noble Lord was wrong in what he said, and that it was intended, by this Vote, and by Motion made, and Question proposed, "That Mr. Bernal and Viscount Palmerston do prepare and bring in the Bill." He SIR B. HALL: I was one of those who gave my vote, and my cordial vote, in favour of the Motion of the noble Lord. I think the course that was pursued by the noble Lord (Lord Palmerston) who sits below me was uncalled for and unprecedented; and I think it would have been more in accordance with the usages of the House, to have allowed my noble Friend to introduce this Bill. But, having supported my noble Friend on this occasion, I cannot go along with him further. I gave my vote in favour of my noble Friend; but I intended to give my vote in the future stages of the Bill in conjunction with my hon. Friend the Member for Montrose. But I am not at all satisfied with the conclusion the noble Lord at the head of the Government has come to, and I do not think he ought to have called on the noble Lord below me to bring in this Bill. has stated to the House that we require a militia-he has stated, as the head of the Government, that we require a further defence. I do not agree with him there; but I think, if the noble Lord states to this House that we do require defence, he ought either to give up the situation he holds as a Minister of the Crown, or proceed with this measure, and I hope the conclusion my noble Friend will come to is this-that he will at once give up office; and when my hon. and gallant Friend the Member for Bradford say she has the greatest horror of a foreign force landing in this country, but that he has a still greater horror of a Protectionist Government coming into power, I say that I have no such horror. We shall see them try their hand at government; and I hope my noble Friend, after the decision that has been come to, will not merely abandon the Bill, but, in consequence of the vote that has been carried against him, will take that constitutional course which he has always taken, and at once intimate his desire no longer to preside over the councils of the Sovereign. LORD JOHN RUSSELL: Sir, I merely rise to say that I thought I had made my meaning sufficiently plain. I stated that I took it for granted, from the result of this Vote, that the Ministers no longer possessed the confidence of this House; and the result of Ministers no longer possessing the confidence of this House will be that the usual course will follow. You said, Sir, a little time ago, that there was no Motion before the House, when I moved that Mr. Bernal and Lord Palmerston be ordered to bring in the Bill. Of course I do not mean to impose that responsibility upon the noble Lord, and I now beg to withdraw the Motion. Motion, by leave, withdrawn. DIFFERENTIAL DUES ACTS. under a Convention, what the Act required to be done by Treaty. Under these circumstances, and seeing that the Bill was only a question of form, he had no objection to accede to the proposition of the right hon. Gentleman. MR. LABOUCHERE begged to state, that the Bill was not to be confined to Spain, but extended to other countries in similar circumstances. MR. HUME thought it was right this Bill should pass, but he complained that this reciprocity convention would throw upon the Consolidated Fund a sum of from 30,000l. to 40,000l., which had hitherto been paid by Spain. He thought they ought to take some steps to free themselves from this charge. "Resolved-That the Chairman be directed to move the House, That leave be given to bring in a Bill to enable Her Majesty to abolish otherwise than by Treaty on condition of Reciprocity Differential Duties on Foreign Ships." House resumed. Resolution reported:-Bill ordered to be brought in by Mr. Labouchere and Mr. Cornewall Lewis. COLONIAL ECCLESIASTICAL LAWS. Order for Committee read; House in Committee. MR. LABOUCHERE said, he rose to move a Resolution, that a Bill be brought in to enable Her Majesty to abolish, under certain conditions, the differential duties on foreign ships. By the law as it at present stood, treaties of reciprocity with foreign countries, must be signed before terms of reciprocity could be granted. Now they had long been in communication with the Government of Spain upon this subject, with regard to which many just complaints had been made by our mer- MR. GLADSTONE said, he rose to chants, that English ships were not put move a preliminary resolution, in order to on the same footing in their ports as enable him to lay on the table a Bill, as Spanish ships in our ports. The Spanish to the principles of which he did not appreGovernment had all along said they had hend there would be any objections. Under nothing to do with English laws; that the present circumstances he would not they were willing to agree to terms of persevere even in taking this preliminary reciprocity, but that they would not enter step, if he thought the Bill was likely to into any Treaty. Of late a diplomatic give rise to any objection. He did not see convention had been entered into on the his hon. Friend the Under Secretary for subject, and the Government proposed to the Colonies in the House, but he had been be allowed by this measure to make the careful to communicate with him, and the agreement with them without a Treaty. Bill had obtained his approbation. The He might, if it were necessary, state that object of the Bill was simply to relieve this was not the first occasion when incon- members of the Church in communion veniences had arisen out of the existing with the Church of England in the ColoAct. A few years ago one of the Southnies from certain supposed legal disabilAmerican States made the same difficulty, ities, which prevented them from taking and he thought it would be obvious to the those measures for the local management House that the meaning of the Act would of their own affairs that other religious bobe carried out if the advantages of reci- dies in the Colonies were in the habit of procity were allowed wherever Her Ma- exercising. He did not mean to give jesty received satisfactory evidence that them any legislative power; he did not our ships were treated in foreign ports on propose in any way to interfere with the the same footing with the ships of other colonial legislatures doing whatever they countries. thought fit; he only proposed to relieve them from that which all must admit was most desirable-that was to relieve them from certain difficulties which arose from MR. HERRIES said, he understood this measure to be one of form, and not of substance; that it was to do for Spain, the state of the law in this country, concerning which doubts existed whether it extended to the Colonies, and out of which doubts had arisen great practical confusion and inconvenience. MR. HUME said, he looked upon all these matters with great jealousy, for he was against interference with the religious matters in the Colonies at all; but if he understood the explanations of the right hon. Gentleman rightly, it would not preclude the Colonies from regulating their own affairs. With that understanding he had no difficulty in agreeing to the Motion. MR. GLADSTONE said, the hon. Gentleman's observation was strictly correct, or rather, he might have gone further, for the object of the Bill was to enable the Colonies to settle their own affairs-that the ecclesiastical affairs of the Colony should be locally managed in the same way as the civil affairs were locally managed. "Resolved-That the Chairman be directed to move the House, That leave be given to bring in a Bill to relieve Bishops in the Colonies in communion with the Church of England, and the Clergy and Laity in communion with them, in respect to legal doubts or disabilities affecting the management of their Church affairs." House resumed. Resolution reported:-Bill ordered to be brought in by Mr. Gladstone and Mr. Oswald. The House adjourned at half after Nine o'clock till Monday next. HOUSE OF LORDS, Monday, February 23, 1852. MINUTES.] PUBLIC BILL.-1a Drainage and Embankment of Lands. really sufficient, and it would be necessary to frame a different provision on the subject. At the bringing up of the Report he would propose a clause to meet the difficulty that had arisen on this important question. RESIGNATION OF THE MINISTRY. The MARQUESS of LANSDOWNE: My Lords, I rise for the purpose of moving that the Order of the Day, which stands for Friday next, for the appointment of a Committee to consider the Affairs of the East India Company, be discharged. My Lords, in making that Motion, your Lordships will readily anticipate that the ground on which I make it is a circumstance which must be already known to all of your Lordships, namely, that all Her Majesty's present Ministers hoid office only until their successors shall have been appointed. My Lords, in making this announcement, I certainly am most anxious to make no observation whatever calculated to excite any difference of opinion, or even to provoke any sort of discussion. I should wish so to abstain under any circumstances, but more especially in the absence of a noble Earl-a noble and much valued friend of mine in all times, though a political opponent-from whom I have within the last hour heard that he has accepted office, and is engaged in forming a new Administration-a task in which, although it is impossible for me to give him any assistance, I am sure I should be the last man to create in his path, were it even in my power, the slightest shade of impediment. I will say that it is not my wish to offer any obstruction to the formation of that or any other Administration under the present circumstances; for we have been of late daily informed that, independent of that Administration which is now being COUNTY COURTS FURTHER EXTENSION formed, there are concealed in this country BILL-EXPLANATION. many anonymous Administrations-equally LORD BROUGHAM said, he had taken able and willing to undertake the duty of into consideration certain suggestions which conducting Her Majesty's affairs, but at had been offered to him by some of his the same time too modest to make their noble and learned Friends with respect to names known, as well as their pretensions. the County Courts further Extension Bill, I have before this stated my opinion-and and having also had some communication every hour's reflection since has confirmed with County Court Judges, he was happy that opinion-that the retention of office to say he thought they had been enabled and the prolongation of official existence to frame a clause which would meet the by a Government which does not obtain difficulty pointed out by a noble Friend of that amount and steadiness of support his, without falling into any other difficulty, which are necessary to enable it to conon the important subject of costs. The duct with efficiency the Queen's affairs, ninth clause of the Bill had been by some not only ceases to be a good, but bethought to be sufficient, but it was not comes productive of evil to the country. Therefore, my Lords, the very moment I was apprised by my noble Friend at the head of the Government, on Saturday morning, that in consequence of what had passed the night before, he was disposed without further delay to resign into Her Majesty's hands the trust that She had confided to him, I instantly signified my entire acquiescence in, and approbation of, that course being adopted; and I am authorised to state that when it was subsequently communicated on the same day to the rest of my Colleagues, they unanimously and unhesitatingly concurred in that opinion. My Lords, I do not know that on this subject it is necessary for me to say more. What I have said I have said on behalf of the Government with which I have been connected, and it is due to the Colleagues with whom I have had the honour and happiness to act; but, my Lords, considering the position in which I feel myself to stand, and considering that it is, I will say most improbable-I ought perhaps to use a stronger word-that I should again under any circumstances address your Lordships from this bench, I may be permitted to add a few words upon that part of the communication I have to make to your Lordships. My Lords, although as long as I have life and health for it, I shall consider it a duty not to remain indifferent to the proceedings of this House upon the great impending questions in times most eventful, and which I am afraid will long continue to be eventful, although I may, in discharge of that duty, take some part in the discussions of the most momentous interest, and upon one of those questions if it should come hereafter to be presented to your Lordships-it will be most satisfactory to me to give my opinion on that question to your Lordships' House, unbiassed and untrammelled by any official relations; nevertheless, whilst attending for such objects, I think the time has arrived when I may reasonably dispense with a constant, or, if I may use the expression in reference to the situation I have held for several years past, a compulsory attendance upon the proceedings of this House. With that feeling I cannot sit down on this occasion without, in the first place, thanking all my noble Friends whom I now see sitting around me-both personal and political-for the warmth and cordiality of that support which from them I have constantly experienced. But, my Lords, I must also add that I shall quit this House deeply indebted to the House at large, and to the great majority-indeed, I will say to all the noble Lords opposite-for the invariable kindness, courtesy, and forbearance which each and every of them have displayed towards me. It has been my lot-and I hope it will always continue to be my lot-to see during that time generally observed in the proceedings of this House that absence of all violence of temper, that absence of all acrimony of feeling, which I am sure is essential to the dignity of your Lordships' House. If I have in any degree assisted to maintain it, it will be to me a source of constant satisfaction, convinced as I am that it is by observing that course and thus characterising your proceedings, your Lordships will best maintain that authority in the country which you derive from its constitution; an authority which, whatever may be said to the contrary, it ought to be the wish of all the sane part of this country you should continue to enjoy. I say of the sane part of this country, because all that portion at least of the public has had occasion within the last few years to see that there is no country with institutions more or less similar to those which give your Lordships a place here, and where these institutions have been hastily abolished, in which after the lapse of a few years, it has not been found most desirable to reconstruct them, but in which it has not been at the same time found that it is much more easy to destroy than to create. I entertain the most ardent hope that under whatever Government this country is placed, your Lordships will continue to maintain a course which entitles you to the respect of the country. I am confident that by deserving that respect you will continue to obtain it. My Lords, having ventured to say this much in stating to you the situation in which I now find myself, I have only to add that it is my intention to propose to your Lordships that, on rising to-night (if I hear of no objection to it), the House shall adjourn till Friday. After the communication I have had from the noble Earl, and to which I have alluded, it is necessary to take this course; but if there be any judicial business, or any business of an ordinary character that it may be found convenient to attend to, I conceive there can be no objection to your Lordships adjourning from day to day, with the perfect understanding that until Friday next no pub lic business shall be transacted. I do not make my Motion at present until I hear |