ber for Tyrone (Lord C. Hamilton), the hon. and gallant Gentleman the Member for Portarlington (Colonel Dunne), and the hon. and learned Gentleman the Member consider this subject, and the result was that the late Chancellor of the Exchequer proposed a vote of 30,000l. for the mitigation of the injuries suffered by the depositors in the Cuffe-street Savings Bank. Now, for the University of Dublin (Mr. Napier); if the guardian of the public purse, the Chancellor of the Exchequer, found the case so strong as to induce him to make that proposition, on what ground could the remaining 10s. in the pound be withheld? He admitted that the moment chosen for bringing forward the question was premature; but that did not alter the justice of the case, and he wished to be understood that he was not advocating the claims of those depositors who had violated the Act of Parliament. and, therefore, he thought it a favourable opportunity to bring the subject again before the House. He regretted that the eloquence of the right hon. and learned Attorney General for Ireland had had so little effect upon the right hon. Gentleman the Chancellor of the Exchequer. He had hoped he would have taken counsel of his Irish advisers on this subject, for they knew its merits well, and could give him good advice upon it. He begged to say that he had no anxiety to call for a diviMR. W. WILLIAMS said, in this case sion on this occasion, provided he had the public had been placed in a most un- something like a reasonable ground to fortunate and anomalous position, for if hope that, when the whole question of the principle were laid down that these Savings Banks came to be considered, losses should be paid out of the public this subject would be taken into considerataxes, every other Savings Bank would tion at the same time; but, unless this have an equal claim. He trusted the assurance were given him, he must divide. right hon. Chancellor of the Exchequer would take into consideration the propriety of making an alteration in the existing law so as to afford protection to the public as well as to the depositors. now. House divided:-Ayes 40; Noes 169: INDUSTRIAL AND PROVIDENT PARTNER- MR. REYNOLDS, in reply, said, he must decline to respond to the appeal made MR. SLANEY, after presenting two to him to withdraw the Motion, after the petitions in favour of Industrial and Provideclaration of the right hon. Gentleman dent Partnerships, proceeded to move for the Chancellor of the Exchequer, that leave to bring in a Bill to legalise the these depositors were fortunate in getting formation of such partnerships. He said so much as they did, and had made a most that the discussion which had just taken capital bargain. Were the right hon. Gen-place was not a bad introduction to the tleman to promise, without pledging himself to any particular decision, that when the whole question of Savings Banks was investigated, the particular case of the Cuffestreet Savings Bank would also be considered, he would, in that case, withdraw the Motion for the present. He had been asked privately why he did not bring forward this subject last year. His answer was, the Ecclesiastical Titles Assumption Bill stood in the way. Until the dogdays almost there was hardly a single night in which he had not some quarrel with Her Majesty's Ministers about that Bill, and from the cat-and-dog life he then led with them, they were, of course, anything but disposed to go out of their way to accommodate him with reference to this or any other subject. But now the case was altered, because he found upon the Ministerial benches opposite no fewer than seven hon. Gentlemen who voted with him in 1850, including the noble Lord the Mem On Motion of which he had given notice, show- had received to his commercial affairs in Borneo, Consul General to the Sultan and independent at the hands of Her Majesty's Commissioner and chiefs of Borneo, whilst prosecuting his lawful commercial proceedings in that country; together with Copy of any Answers thereto." The same the Kingdom, who all expressed their ear-ing of the obstructions and discouragements he nest desire that facilities should be given to them to make investments of their savings. In 1850 he was fortunate enough to obtain a Committee to investigate the legal obstacles which stood in the way of investments of the middle and humbler classes, and those obstacles were clearly pointed out in the Report of that Committee. Last year a Committee sat upon the Law of Partnership, and the obstacles which that law placed in the way of these humble parties, and they reiterated the recommendations stated in the first report, that those obstacles ought to be removed which prevented the advantageous employment of small savings. The main principle which affected the welfare of the wages of the people, was simple and clear. It was too often neglected, but was of the first consequence to be understood. Their wages must depend upon the proportion of the supply to the demand, and the amount of capital employed. The legal obstacles which stood in the way of the accumulation of capital, and of the use of that capital in the demand for labour, were extremely great. When these parties joined together their capital and industry, if one single person took hold of the partnership property, there was no tribunal before which he could be brought to answer for his misdeeds; there was no mode in which they could sue or be sued. What they asked was this: the enactment of a simple law, enabling them to invest in directors of their own choice their own property, and the establishment of a simple tribunal for the settlement of those disputes. They did not ask for unlimited liability, but simply that the provisions of the Friendly Societies Act (13 & 14 Vict., c. 115) should be extended to them. MR. HENRY DRUMMOND said, the hon. Gentleman a few nights ago had given notice of a Motion similar to the present, but that Motion contained a statement that was not the fact. operation was performed by the hon. Gentleman several times last year. He kept continual Motions on the paper relating to the conduct of Sir James Brooke; and, upon the same principle, he (Mr. H. Drummond) supposed, that calumny, like flattery, should be laid on thick enough, so that some of it at last might stick, the hon. Member had contrived to keep that gentleman's name before the House until the end of the Session. The hon. Gentleman had had the kindness and urbanity to write him a private letter to beg him to take the earliest opportunity, when this subject came before the House, to make some amende respecting some observations which he (Mr. H. Drummond) had made as applied to a Mr. Miles last year. He (Mr. H. Drummond) replied to the hon. Gentleman in general terms that he would not do in private that justice to Mr. Miles which the hon. Gentleman had requested him to do, but he would do that justice to Mr. Miles in his place in that House whenever an opportunity occurred. Repeatedly had he sought that opportunity, but never had he been able to get one; and he was not now going to apologise for, or extenuate, or deny one word he had said last year; on the contrary, he only insinuated last year that which now he was going to assert positively, that this Miles was a runaway convict. The hon. Gentleman had himself not clean hands with respect to this Miles, for he had published in the papers read in this House a letter from this Miles, which he (Mr. Drummond) had shown to be a forgery. He proved it to be a forgery from the handwriting of that gentleman-a gentleman he would not call him—of that man, and that he could neither spell nor write. Nevertheless, that false testimony the hon. Gentleman made use of, and never had he explained either to Sir James Brooke "That an humble Address be presented to Her or to that House why he brought forMajesty, that She will be graciously pleased toward that false testimony. He (Mr. H. give directions that there be laid before this Drummond) had asserted that Miles, to Viscount Palmerston, dated Singapore, 28th upon whose information the hon. Gentleday of June, 1851, with its Inclosures, complain- man relied, was a runaway convict. He part MR. WALPOLE said, that on the of the Government he should not offer objection to the introduction of the Bill, the details of which could be discussed on a future occasion. Leave given; Bill ordered to be brought in by Mr. Slaney, Mr. Sotheron, and Mr. Tufnell. BORNEO-SIR JAMES BROOKE. MR. HUME moved Ilouse, a Copy of Letter from Mr. Robert Burns insinuated it before; he now said it, and he said that Miles was worse-that he was a thoroughly worthless fellow, and he would now proceed to prove what he had stated. He had an affidavit by a Mr. Henry Adams, which was as follows: "Western Australia, Perth, Oct. 10, 1851. 'I, Henry Adams, late of Adelaide, in the province of South Australia, but now of the colony of Western Australia, master mariner, master and owner of the schooner Unknown, solemnly declare as follows:-That is to say, that I was in the police force in the province of South Australia for about fifteen months; that a person who passed by the name of Peter Loyd kept a house of ill fame called the Scotch Thistle; that the police force always had their eyes on the said Peter Loyd, as he was considered a very bad character, and that the Scotch Thistle was frequently searched by the police for stolen goods, and for persons suspected of robberies; that I saw a man called William Miller accuse the said Peter Loyd openly upon a racecourse in South Australia of having picked his pocket, when seve ral bystanders declared they had seen the theft committed by the said Peter Loyd, and when I saw the said Peter Loyd return the said William Miller the sum of 3s., being the amount alleged to have been stolen from him on that occasion by the said Peter Loyd; that the stores of Messrs. Murray and Gregg, of Adelaide, were robbed, and that there was very strong ground for suspecting the robbery had been committed by the said Peter Loyd and a man named — Ring; that a reward was offered by the local Government for their apprehension, and the police were sent in search of them, but were unable to arrest them, as they rode to Cape Jervis, and succeeded in getting on board a vessel shortly before the arrival of the police in pursuit; that I knew him, Peter Loyd, well during his residence in Adelaide, and that he there lived with a woman who passed as his wife, and who escaped with him from Cape Jervis; that I heard this woman state that he, Peter Loyd, was a runaway convict: that I did not again see the said Peter Loyd, until the year 1844, when he arrived at Freemantle, in the said colony of West Australia, as owner of the Buffalo, from Singapore, and passed under the name of William Henry Miles; that I at once recognised him, and could not be mistaken as to his identity; that I then heard he was about to be married to a "Subscribed by the abovenamed H. E. Adams in my presence, at Perth, Western Australia, this 10th day of October, 1851. (Signed) "W. H. MACKIE, J.P., Commissioner of the Civil Court of Western Australia, and Chairman of the Court f It was upon the authority of that man that kept a gig. MR. HUME hoped the hon. Gentleman who had just spoken would tell the House where he had got the document from which he had just read. For himself, he would say that he did not believe a word of the allegations contained in it. He had stated to the hon. Gentleman, that as he had in his place calumniated Mr. Miles, he thought it was an act of justice to explain it, and he asked the hon. Gentleman whether he had seen the proceedings that had taken place in the Court of Singapore against the Singapore Free Press for a libel, in consequence of the statement mentioned by the hon. Gentleman. Mr. Miles's letter was given to him by a merchant on whose authority he relied, and he published it on that authority-the authority of a respectable English merchant in this country. The hon. Gentleman had on a former occasion produced a document, and said that Mr. Miles could not write. The letter, certainly, was badly spelt; and, if that was a type of what that individual could daughter of a Mr. Wickstead, who kept a public-write, he should say it was not very crehouse at Freemantle, and that I conceived it to be my duty to, and I accordingly did, communicate to Mr. Wickstead what I knew of the said Peter Loyd or William Henry Miles, and particularly that I had reason to believe he was then a married man; that I afterwards met at Singapore several persons who informed me that the woman whom I had formerly known as the wife of the said Peter Loyd, or William Henry Miles, at Adelaide, and also Mrs. Miles, the daughter of the said Mr. Wickstead, whom the said Peter Loyd, or William Henry Miles, married at Freemantle aforesaid, had both been resident at Singapore together; but I did not on that occasion see the said Peter Loyd, or William Henry Miles, as he was then at Labuan, where I learned he had gone to lease or work a coal mine. (Signed) "H. E. ADAMS." ditable. But how did that letter get into the possession of the hon. Gentleman? Was it stolen when the troops made the attack which had before been referred to, at the suggestion of Sir James Brooke? and did that hon. Gentleman know that Mr. Miles had brought an action in the Court of Singapore against Sir James Brooke or his agent? In the opinion of the Judge at Singapore, the real libeller was the hon. Member for West Surrey. As to Sir James Brooke, his conduct had continued as monstrous as it had begun. Before any satisfaction had been made for his previous excesses, Sir James Brooke, Notice taken, that forty Members were not present. House counted, and forty Members not being present, The House was adjourned at Eight o'clock. -mmmmm HOUSE OF LORDS, Friday, March 19, 1852. MINUTES.] PUBLIC BILL.-2a Patent Law Amendment (No. 2). COMMERCIAL POLICY. on the 31st of July, had an ambush laid | Earl of DERBY dissented.] I certainly unfor 4,000 persons, whom, in order to derstood the noble Earl to say, that an create a pretext for plundering them, he auctioneer was not a competent judge on chose to call pirates, whereas they were such a subject; but whether that be so or not pirates, nor anything of the sort: they not, I wish to call your Lordships' attenwere Dyaks. If there were any pirates, tion to the petition which I have now the they are Malays. Of those 4,000 persons, honour of presenting, and which I received 500 were barbarously slaughtered, and the day after the former petition was pre1,500 more or less injured; for the mas- sented, not indeed from Snaith, but from sacre and injuries of these poor people the Manchester-not from an auctioneer and a Government had to pay 20,7007.; yet no surgeon, but from men whose entire lives inquiry was to be granted into this barbar- have been devoted to the consideration of ous and disgraceful outrage. commercial questions-men whom even the noble Earl must admit to be intimately acquainted with such subjects-men whom, as a resident and large proprietor in the same county, and as a Member of this House, and as Prime Minister of this country, the noble Earl must regard with respect when they come before your Lordships for the purpose of expressing their opinions on any, but more especially on this, subject. The petition comes from the Manchester Commercial Association. And what is that Association? It is not a political association-it is not even, so far as I know, opposed in general politics to those of the noble Earl; but it is comThe DUKE of NEWCASTLE, in pur-posed of men who combine together for suance of his notice, presented a petition no other object than to promote the gefrom the Directors of the Manchester Com-neral interests of commerce-of men who mercial Association, praying that the coun- differ on all political points excepting this try may as speedily as possible be relieved of men who for the most part never from the state of anxiety and suspense belonged, I believe, to any party, either which at present so extensively prevails in this or any other House of Parliament among all classes of the population as to-and of men who never come before the course of Commercial Policy which Her us except on questions with which they Majesty's Government proposes to adopt ; feel themselves peculiarly conversant. I and said: I should have been happy, my therefore think, my Lords, that you will Lords, to have pursued the more usual agree with me that some deference is due course in regard to petitions sent up to to them, and that, however you may be inyour Lordships' House, and to have pre-clined to dispute the competency of others sented this petition without giving notice, or without even the few observations with which I think it now necessary to preface the presentation of it, had it not happened that in his speech on Monday last the noble Earl at the head of Her Majesty's Government, in dealing with another petition on the same subject, besides amusing the House with various jokes at the expense of the petitioners who signed it, denied the truth of their grave assertions, and expressed his doubts of the alarm which they professed to feel, and altogether impugned the justice of the prayer with which they concluded. As the noble Earl on that occasion laid great stress on the ignorance of those petitioners with regard to the subject with which they were dealing- [The to judge of this question, you must attach "To the Right Hon. the Lords Spiritual and Tem- ing deeply conscious of the great advantages which Humbly showeth-That your petitioners, be "That your petitioners are firmly of opinion that no return to protective duties can be perma merce. "Your petitioners would, therefore, most respectfully but earnestly entreat your Lordships to relieve the country as speedily as possible from that state of anxiety and suspense which at present so extensively prevails among all classes of the population as to the course of commercial policy which Her Majesty's Government proposes to adopt. And your petitioners will ever pray. "Manchester, March 10." nent, and that any attempt at their re-establish- may add a higher, footing. I am not, ment would only lead to continued and organised however, looking so much to the interests agitation. "That a state of uncertainty is at all times of those countries, as I am, my Lords, to prejudicial to the operations of trade and com- the interests of this country, which appear to be stagnated by the uncertainty which now prevails as to the continuance of free trade. If I should be told, in that stereotyped phrase which I have seen used in so many addresses to the electors of this country, that this is a matter of indifference, because you cannot fight hostile tariffs with free imports, I shall reply with the undeniable fact that this is by no Now I hope, my Lords, that I may be means an undisputed axiom; for however permitted to add my humble testimony to little we may have met with reciprocity in the truth of these assertions, so far as my other times, this I can say, that there experience in my own county-a large never was a time in the days of recipromanufacturing and agricultural county-is city treaties and treaties of commerce concerned. The noble Earl on a former when so large a relaxation of hostile tariffs occasion seemed to entertain doubts whe- was made as has been made during the ther any mischief or inconvenience could prevalence of the principles of free trade. result at the present time to the agricul- If any inconvenience is still felt on this tural part of the community, from the point, it does not attach to the establishstate of uncertainty in which the country ment of the system of free importations is left regarding the question of free trade, without any guarantee for their reciprobecause, he said, the operations of hus- city, but it has arisen from the uncerbandry were over, and would not be re- tainty which has prevailed as to our persumed for some months to come. But, severance in the system during the last my Lords, there are other more important five or six years; and it is owing to the matters respecting which this suspense course adopted by the noble Earl opmust be of the greatest possible mischief. posite and his friends around him, and It must prove mischievous, not merely by certain hon. Gentlemen in the other with regard to contracts between landlord and tenant, but with reference to many other transactions; and it leaves a doubt on the minds of the farmers of the country, which is greatly to be deprecated under any circumstances. I could easily show, my Lords, that if the agricultural interest be injuriously affected by this suspense, the manufacturing and commercial interests are still more so. The noble Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, who is now sitting by the side of the noble Earl, must be well aware that already from various parts of the Continent we have received representations of the mischief accruing to them from this uncertainty existing in the English markets. [The Earl of MALMESBURY intimated his dissent.] The noble Earl appears to doubt the fact; but I have myself seen representations from Austria, Naples, and Denmark, all communicating the mischief which those States apprehend from the continuance of suspense in the operations of trade in this country. I may be told that countries like Austria and Naples, whose policy is so restrictive, have no reason to complain; but Denmark stands on a different, and I House of Parliament, that this uncertainty has existed so long. I know that you may tell us-and justly and consistently with your views-that the fault lies with us, because we introduced the system to which you are hostile, and which you consider to be false, impolitic, and abortive; whilst we attribute it to obstinacy on the part of those to whom we are opposed, who attempt to maintain false principles of trade, and desire the revival of an obsolete and exploded system. But, my Lords, it is not merely as to the trade in corn that this uncertainty is prevalent. It prevails, and must continue to prevail, as to all other articles of commerce. I was glad to find that the right hon. Gentleman the Secretary of State for the Colonies an nounced the other day in his place in the other House of Parliament, that it was not his intention to proceed this Session with a Bill which he had introduced there, but before he was appointed to his present office-I mean a Bill for the suspension of the scale by which the sugar duties have been graduated, and that he reserves for a future Session that question; but, nevertheless, there must exist great uncertainty |