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last 10 years. For instance, the total | had watered certain streets; and if he rating of Kensington, from the year 1870 was found guilty of neglect he was blown to 1879, averaged 38. 9d. in the pound; up. He himself had made a complaint that whereas, in the present year, the rating a particular road was not watered proamounted to only 3s. 5d., a decrease of perly on the Sunday, and his complaint 4d. on the whole, although the charge was attended to, and since then the state for the Metropolitan School Board had of things had been much better. If any increased from nothing to 5d., and the hon. Member felt aggrieved in reference Metropolitan Board rate had also in- to the watering of the streets on Sundays, creased. He differed from the remarks provided that hon. Member lived in his of his hon. Friend the Member for (Mr. J. R. Yorke's) district, and proFinsbury (Sir Andrew Lusk) as to the vided, also, that he would write a letter, constitution of the vestries. He thought he (Mr. J. R. Yorke) would, of course, it required improvement. There was a do his best to see that the matter was atwant of a head and of responsible officers tended to. About three autumns ago he known to the public. As to the com- was in London for a month, and the conplaint that the management of paro- dition of the water was at that time inchial affairs was in the hands of small tolerable, and it was extremely untradesmen, he thought that gentlemen pleasant to the nose. The water, he had themselves to blame in that respect, believed, came from the Chelsea Combecause it was owing to their negligence pany. He took a sample to Professor that such was the case. If people wished Franklin and asked him to analyze it. to improve the management of their The Professor told him that he had alaffairs, they should take a more active ready analyzed water from the same part themselves. Company, and showed him a long tube containing some of it, in which he noticed a large number of unpleasantlooking bodies in suspension. He asked would there be any use in filtering the water, but was told that it would be useless, because all the really deleterious matters were to be found in solution, and not in suspension; and, in fact, it was only a question between the thick and the thin turtle. He asked the Professor the nature of the thing, and he said that he found things in the water that led him to believe that they came from Surbiton. There had recently been a flood in that locality, and some of the contents of the cesspools of the place had been washed into the reservoirs. He had naturally since that time kept his eyes open to the quality of the water coming from the Chelsea Waterworks, and he had noticed whether there had been any extensive floods in that neighbourhood, so that he might not drink any more water than he could help. He thought the defence which the right hon. Gentleman the President of the Local Government Board had made for the vestries, that they were not responsible for a great deal of the charges laid at their door, was a just one. He would conclude by saying that if some arrangement could be made for a proper audit of vestry accounts, it would be a real and substantial improvement; and he hoped that, ere long, whenever there might be

MR. J. R. YORKE said, that this year he had been elected a vestryman for the City of Westminster, and he had been induced to become a member of the Board, not from any motive of public spirit, but from a feeling of curiosity. One heard so much of the working of these bodies that he desired to see the machinery from the inside. No doubt, the majority of those who composed the vestries were small tradesmen; but, considering the nature of the duties they had to discharge, he was not surprised that a great many gentlemen did not care to serve on them. They had to administer the greater portion of their funds under the direction of the Metropolitan Board, and the amount over which they themselves had control was very small. The hon. Member (Mr. C. Beckett-Denison) had stated that the dust was badly laid in the streets on Sundays; and he might say that he was a member of a Street Cleansing Committee for the City of Westminster, and, therefore, he could say that how the matter was done was thus-The contracts were drawn in general terms, the contractors undertaking to keep the streets in proper order under the vestry. The vestry could be set in motion by any ratepayer who chose to communicate with them; and when communicated with they summoned the contractor to produce his books, to show how often he Sir George Campbell

an opportunity of legislating upon the | tertained with respect to what he said subject, it would be provided.

last year. One hon. Gentleman went so SIR CHARLES W. DILKE said, that, far as to state that he had distinctly to his own knowledge, the hon. Member promised that Government would take for Hackney (Mr. Fawcett) had been, up the question and deal with it in the from the commencement of the Session, course of the present Session, and had endeavouring to obtain a night on which called him over the coals for not having to call the attention of the House to the carried that promise to fulfilment; but, question of the water supply of the Me- certainly, that was not the view of what tropolis, which was a very large question, he had said taken by the right hon. and ought to be discussed by itself. The Gentleman the Member for the Univerhon. Gentleman the Member for the sity of London (Mr. Lowe), who had, West Riding of Yorkshire (Mr. C. upon the occasion in question, comBeckett-Denison), speaking of the water- plained that he had not made any defiing of the streets, had told them that, nite statement upon the matter, but had in that respect, London was infinitely treated it in a light manner as if it were worse than Paris and other Continental a question of no importance. All he cities. That was so; but then the streets could say was that they were both misin those cities were watered, not by taken. There was, however, no one carts, as in London, but by fixed hy- more sensible of the importance of the drants; and this question should be dis- question than he was; but then it was cussed on the Water Supply Motion. It one which must be dealt with as a whole, should be borne in mind that the popu- and not in piecemeal. The hon. Genlation in foreign cities was much more tleman the Member for Peterborough densely concentrated than in London, (Mr. Hankey) seemed enamoured of the owing to the practice of the people living one idea that the whole of the Metroin flats; so that the 12 arrondissements polis should be included in the City of which constituted the older City of London. That was a startling proposiParis, as contrasted with the outer ring tion, so much so, indeed, that the hon. of 8 arrondissements, were much less and gallant Baronet the Chairman of the in area than the borough he had the Metropolitan Board immediately rose honour to represent. Still, he believed from his seat and left the House. If, considerable improvement had been however, the hon. Gentleman the Memmade within the last few years. As to ber for Peterborough would embody the paving of London, no one could say that proposal in a Bill, and submit it to that it was all that it ought to be; but the House, it was probable the hon. and considerable improvement had been gallant Baronet would remain in his seat brought about. The existing boards and let the hon. Member understand that were becoming alive to the question. As there were weighty objections to it. As regarded the contracts for scavengering, regarded the reform of the City of Lonseveral vestries had given up the practice don, it was a large and serious question, of entering into them, and did the work and had been considered by Committee for themselves. It had been said that after Committee and by Commission the London vestries had no permanent after Commission, which had, no doubt, officials; but he must say that the vestry collected a vast amount of material for clerks, as a rule, were well chosen and Government to deal with, and such was very able men, and generally they had its importance that no person but the served for a great number of years. He Government should attempt to do so. hoped that the debate would not close There were, however, several minor without there being a renewed assur-points--minor points as regarded the ance that the Home Secretary would go into the whole question.

MR. ASSHETON CROSS said, that, considering the terms of the Motion, they might conclude that they had discussed this question enough for all practical purposes. He quite agreed in the general view expressed in the Motion; but he was in this unfortunate position-that different views were en

main question, but still of great importance in themselves. Such was the watering of the streets, and such was the efficiency of the fire brigade; but both these questions depended upon a much larger one, which was that of the general water supply. He looked upon that as one of very great importance, for the water supplied for household use was in such a state that it ought to be

Paper bearing upon these subjects were brought forward, he would be quite prepared to state the views of the Government upon them. He might add, in conclusion, that his hon. Friend had suggested one practical question which was well worthy of consideration, and that was, if they could not obtain a regular Government audit of vestry accounts. That was a subject which, in his (Mr. Assheton Cross's) opinion, must be dealt with before long.

MR. BAILLIE COCHRANE said, that after the discussion which had occurred he should, with the permission of the House, withdraw his Amendment. Question put, and agreed to.

Main Question proposed, "That Mr. Speaker do now leave the Chair."

RAILWAYS - RAILWAY ACCIDENTS — THE ADOPTION OF CONTINUOUS BRAKES.-OBSERVATIONS.

MR. BAXTER, who had on the Paper the following Amendment ::

discontinued. There were a great many minor questions involved in this which ought to be dealt with at once, for he was not one of those who thought that if they could not at once carry some gigantic measure of reform they should not attempt reforms in detail. Besides the defective system of local government in the Metropolis, there was the defective system of vestry administration. He was glad to find that his hon. Friend the Member for East Gloucestershire (Mr. J. R. Yorke) had joined the vestry of his parish, for the great difficulty in the way of the system of local government by vestries was the inability to find gentlemen of ability and social standing to undertake the duties of vestrymen, where they obtained no honour, but had to undertake a great deal of work, and disagreeable work, for which they received no thanks. There was no doubt the nature of the election prevented gentlemen of that class seeking for seats on the vestry; and, therefore, he would at once remove every impediment in the way of obtaining the best men to serve. Some gentlemen were of opinion that the functions of vestrymen were smallthey were small in one sense; but in another they were of the utmost importance, as upon them to a large extent depended the comfort, the domestic happiness, the health, and the daily convenience of the inhabitants. In the first place, it was the duty of the vestrymen to see that the house-drains were properly connected with the sewers; but he believed few of them took that trouble. [Mr. J. R. YORKE: They do not.] They had it, then, on the authority of a vestryman that they never did that duty. Again, as regarded the filthy state of the footpaths. The duty of keeping them clean rested with the occupiers of the houses forming the frontage; but if they neglected to do so, then it was for the vestries to step in and put the law in force by compelling them to do so. Then, as to the watering of the streets, he agreed that the system of watering in Paris was superior to theirs. But the watering of the streets and the efficiency of the fire brigade could not, he repeated, be well dealt with apart from the general question of the water supply. He did not wish to put aside that great question; but it would be irregular for him to deal with it until it came before the House as a whole. When the Motions on the

Jr. Assheton Cross

"That, in the opinion of this House, it is now the duty of the Government to take such measures as may be necessary to secure, within a fixed and reasonable time, the application to all Railway passenger vehicles in the United Kingdom of Continuous Brakes which comply with the conditions laid down by the Board of Trade as essential to public safety;" said: If the House will give me its attention for a short period, I think I shall be able to state a case so strong that if Members were not convinced, the fault must be with the exponent, and him alone. I think it is incumbent upon me to show to the House, in the first place, that the danger to which we are exposed in railway travelling, and from which the use of proper brakes would save us, is of sufficient importance to call for the interference of Parliament. I hold in my hand an analysis of the railway accidents which have taken place during six years. I find that, between 1870 and 1876, there were 1,234 accidents which were of sufficient importance to be inquired into by officials of the Board of Trade; and of these, 952, or nearly four-fifths, might have been prevented, or mitigated, at all events-so the gentlemen say who have looked into the matter-by the use of efficient brakes. The yearly average of accidents investigated was 176. This large number might have been reduced

by 136, in the opinion of the officials, by number of years, to justify the interferproper brakes having been used. Seve- ence of this House. Evidence on this ral of the accidents which have of late point is very abundant, as the question occurred have been of a very disastrous is no new one. But I will only trouble character. In one, at Wigan, 44 per- the House with one or two instances. I sons were killed or injured; at Skipton, have heard hon. Gentlemen say that we 103 persons; at Norwich, 130; at Rip- have not given the Railway Companies ton, 72; at Armley Junction, 122; and time enough. My answer to that is that at Newark, 59. The year 1877, as many as long ago as September, 1858, the hon. Gentlemen will remember, was a Board of Trade issued a Circular, in year singularly free from railway acci- which they say the amount of brake dents. During that year 675 passengers power then habitually supplied to trains and 176 railway servants were killed or was in most cases insufficient to prevent injured by accidents to trains; and, ap- the occurrence of accidents, and it was plying to this year the proportion of the essential to the safety of trains going at last six years, I have ascertained that in a high rate of speed that the engine1877 nearly 700 persons have sustained drivers should have power to stop the injuries by accident which efficient brakes trains, having had notice of the obmight have prevented. In 1876 the struction of the line, before they reach numbers of killed and injured were over the obstructed point. From that day to 1,300; in 1874 they were nearly 1,600; this, for 20 years, the Board of Trade and the Board of Trade Returns just has been continually knocking at the issued show the numbers killed and in- door of the Railway Companies to give jured in 1878 were considerably more sufficient brake power. I ask hon. Genthan in 1877-1,074 persons being killed tlemen do they not read with pain these or injured last year. I admit at once Returns made every year of the number that these casualties, lamentable as they of casualties, carrying mourning and are, are inconsiderable compared with sorrow into so many homes, seeing that the enormous number of journeys per- they might have been avoided had proformed each year-over, I believe, per brakes been adopted? For 20 years 600,000,000. But the House must keep the Board of Trade have been warning in mind that the proportion of the pub- and remonstrating with the Railway lic travelling habitually is small; and, Companies, and one would have thought therefore, the danger to which they are they would by this time have given up exposed is confined to a comparatively the task in despair, and have called small number of individuals. I do not upon Parliament to assist them in enfor one moment propose to complain forcing what was required. The tone of of the general management of the remonstrance has now been superseded by railways of this country. On the con- one of threatening. This tone culminated trary, when I think of the number of in August, 1877, in a very significant intrains continually running, not only intimation-one in which I most cordially daylight, but in the darkness-running, too, at an enormously high speed-I am filled with admiration at the organization, the skill, and the care which enable us to travel with only those dangers which we do now encounter. But whilst giving the Companies the utmost credit for the degree of safety they have obtained for us, I think the figures I have quoted show conclusively that there are still great dangers to life and limb for which it behoves us to adopt remedial measures. In the second place, it is my duty to show to the House, before inviting Parliament to compel Railway Companies to take such remedial measures, that the Railway Companies have been warned of the state of matters with sufficient urgency, and for a sufficient

approve. Last year was passed an Act which gave warning to Railway Companies that if they did not adopt a proper system of brakes they must be compulsorily interfered with. I have said enough to show that the Companies had warning sufficiently urgent and for sufficiently long a period of time to justify the interference of this House. Now, I am going to lay before the House the manner in which these warnings have been received, and to show the House what has been provided in this essential matter for the public safety. I take, first, the London and North Western Company. They use a brake, regarding which the Board of Trade wrote to the Company in March, 1877, in the following remarkable terms:

"The Board of Trade desire me again most | bility by continuing to use it." This is a seriously to urge upon the Directors the neces- cogent reason for the interference of sity of re-considering their system of brakes. Inquiries and experiments have shown that Parliament. Then, take the Midland there are brakes which fulfil the conditions Company, they use six different brakes, mentioned in the Board of Trade Circular, and some of which are in accordance with should the London and North Western Railway the conditions of the Board of Trade, Company, after such experience as that afforded and some of which are not; but, surely, by the present case-an accident near Warrington Station, in which the brake was proved to they should be uniform. The Midland be quite ineffective-hesitate to adopt an efficient Company go in for a large variety of continuous brake, and to issue and enforce such brakes which, I believe, in the end will regulations as will insure its proper working, land them in great confusion and enorthe confidence of the public in the earnest and mous expense. The Great Northern anxious desire of the Company to do all that lies in their power to secure the safety of rail- Company adopted a continuous brake at way travellers will be at an end; and in the an early period, and showed that they event of a casualty occurring which an efficient were very enlightened in doing so; but, system of brake might have prevented a heavy unfortunately, the brake does not conpersonal responsibility would rest upon those form to the conditions now laid down by who are answerable for such neglect.' the Board of Trade, and I cannot help thinking that it is unfortunate that the

But there is an opposition on the part of the London and North Western Com-directors should go on making brakes pany to give preference to a self-acting brake. At the recent half-yearly meeting, Mr. Moon, the Chairman, stated that the directors set their faces against selfacting brakes; and, further, that he did not believe any man in his senses would say they ought to risk their trains with a self-acting brake. That is a policy which has been most consistently followed by that Company. They have fitted 600 brakes since the Circulars of the Board of Trade were published, every one of which was not in accordance with these conditions. The London and North Western Company not only thought itself powerful enough to treat with absolute contempt and indifference the Circulars of the Board of Trade, but they flew at higher game, and defied the authority of this House. A Royal Commission was appointed in 1874, and reported in 1877 as follows:

"We recommend that the Railway Companies should be required by law, under adequate penalties, to supply all trains with sufficient brake power to stop them within 500 yards

under all circumstances."

Now, this was proposed by men who, according to Mr. Moon, are not in their senses; and he went further, and said Parliament dare not pass such a Resolution. The London and North Western Railway Company carry about one-tenth of the whole passenger traffic of the United Kingdom. The Queen and Royal Family go by it twice a-year to Scotland. Yet on this line they are habitually using a brake so inefficient that the Board of Trade warns the directors that "they incur a personal responsi

Mr. Baxter

which it is absolutely certain must be replaced very shortly. The Caledonian Company, I am sorry to say, as a Scotchman, have been experimenting with brakes for eight years without any result at all. The North Eastern Company intimated a year ago that they had adopted a brake which they meant to apply over all the system; but I do not find that they have succeeded in carrying out this excellent resolution. I have been informed-rightly or wrongly I do not know - that the Companies, believing that the Government intend immediately to legislate in the sense of the Resolution I have laid upon the Table of the House, have stopped the little progress which they have been making in the matter, and are waiting, with folded hands, to be delivered by this House out of a dilemma which is really painful, but from which, I believe, they are perfectly unable to extricate themselves. I think I have shown the little progress which has been made; but the most alarming fact is that this little progress has been in entirely a wrong direction. The larger proportion of the brakes fitted do not conform to the conditions laid down by the Board of Trade as absolutely essential to the public safety, and to the uniformity which is absolutely necessary. The money part of the question is a subject for the shareholders to decide; and it is time they should see that the majority of the Railway Companies are providing brakes which need not be renewed in a few years' time. But we have to deal with the safety of our countrymen and country women,

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