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APRIL 13, 1830.]

Buffalo and New Orleans Road.

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fect of their kinds, within the legitimate spheres of their enlargement, when there is no necessity for doing so. action, but utterly void when extended further; and that, There is no necessity for it in this case-and I put this if we have the power to make roads, the assent of indivi-point home to every member of this committee. "We are dual States is wholly unnecessary; but that, if we have not told that this Government is to go on making internal imsuch power, we cannot confer it on the several States provements all over the Union-and that, after the paywhich have it already. On the question whether this Go-ment of the national debt, millions on millions, every year, vernment has such power, we have had much of argument are to be expended in this way. If so, what will the paand of authority. I have enough to do, on this occasion, tronage of the Executive come to? Or rather, what will without entering minutely into a discussion of that point, it not be? Can the opponents of any administration ever which has been, however, and will incidentally be touched wish to see it possessed of such power? And no friend of in the course of my remarks. But I could not fail to notice his country ought ever to desire it for a President of his the pleasure with which the chairman of the Committee on own choice. But the gentleman over the way [Mr. MERRoads and Canals, and other gentlemen, have pressed on CER] has told us that there is no danger at all on the score our attention the sayings of certain great men (Jefferson, of patronage-and he says, that this system will give us Madison, and Monroe) concerning the advantages which opportunities of doing some good while we enjoy our might attend the exercise of such a power by this Govern- places on this floor, and tend to prevent members of ment. Yes, which might attend it, if not abused; but Congress from running to Executive bureaux in search of there is the danger. I have lived long enough, however, offices. I confess that I am at some loss to comprehend the to know how easy it is for the greatest men to throw out honorable gentleman's meaning. But I am apprised of obitur dicta, either as judges or politicians, not much to be his profitable experience on this subject, and doubt not regarded, even, by themselves, and often repudiated after that he might be able, from that, to inform us more fully more reflection and greater experience. But if these say how to provide for ourselves, so as effectually to prevent ings are of high authority as to expediency, I would ask the necessity of running to the bureau. It may be that gentlemen to reflect, if the argument as to power is not there are ways and means for getting such things done proportionally stronger against them, when these same in- and, possibly, that gentleman may understand, better than dividuals, and sometimes in the most solemn manner, with any other, how a member of Congress, by using extraor all their partiality for the power, have felt themselves con- dinary exertions to obtain from this Government a million strained to deny its constitutional existence, as claimed in of dollars or more for some project of internal improvethis bill. We have no evidence that any of them ever ment, might get himself into a berth worth fifteen hunchanged his opinion as to the power; but it is well known dred or two thousand dollars a year, in addition to his pay that Mr. Jefferson, at least, became perfectly satisfied here-and thus be freed from the necessity of running to that the evils from exercising such a power would far over- a bureau to get an office worth less than the double busibalance the advantages. If no such power exists, this Go-ness of President of a Canal Board and member of Convernment ought to seek some other mode of attaining its ends, continuing to act in its own sphere, and attending to its own business, without interfering with that of others, even by permission. But, whether it exists or not, it is a mistake to suppose that there are not very important differences, both in principles and details, between the plan of the amendment and that of the bill.

gress. I am not satisfied, however, that such successful adventures of members of Congress would tend much to diminish the patronage, or any other evils which may have been apprehended.

Economy is another consideration which ought never to be overlooked. No proposition, I take it, is better established, both by reason and experience, than that, with equal means to accomplish a given work, the General Government would be less economical than the State Governments, and they less than corporate companies, and they less than individuals. What the difference would be, can, of course, be only matter of conjecture, as the means of calculation are vague and contingent; but it is fair to suppose that a third or a fourth would be saved by expending the money under State authority, instead of this Government; or that the road would be in that proportion better, if any particular sum by the mile were applied to the work. But there is one feature of the amendment which I consider peculiarly felicitous, in its tendency to economy, security, and faithfulness generally, in the disbursement; and that is the power of the President to withhold the subsequent instalments, if the former should not be properly applied. While the money would be expended under the superior economy of State authorities, on an object desirable to have accomplished, a resonable security for this Government, and restraint on others, would exist in the salutary supervision and conditional control of the President.

The bill proposes that this Government shall exercise entire and absolute control and jurisdiction over the whole subject. On the other hand, the amendment contemplates, that when the General Government, for its own legitimate purposes, shall desire an improved road in a particular direction, it will indicate its wish to the State authorities, and offer the necessary funds on terms advantageous to all. In this way neither Government would confer any new powers on the other. The State would not give its assent for the General Government to do that which was to be done by itself; nor would this Government confer on the State any authority to do that which the State had an undoubted right to do before. In making and preserving such a road, any State would exercise precisely the same powers as are in operation every day, and would use the money from this Government precisely as if it had been derived from any other source. On the other hand, this Government would use the road as it now uses all the roads made by the States throughout the Union; and, in its lawful operations, instead of using bad roads without pay, or improved ones by paying tolls as it now does, would have given so much money for the free use forever of a It seems to me that, on the great points of jurisdiction, good road. As to jurisdiction, the whole community and patronage, and economy, the plan of the amendment is the respective Governments would stand precisely as they unquestionably preferable to that of the bill, and that, if do at this day, without any controversy whatever on that the road is to be made, it had better be done under State subject, while the object of all would have been attained. authority. But as some gentleman still think, no doubt, Not only would all collisions and difficulties as to jurisdic- that this bill may answer the purpose, I must ask their tion be obviated by the plan of the amendment, but that attention to some further particulars. This bill is a legispatronage, which is inseparable from the subject, would lative curiosity. It must be kept in mind that the Presiremain scattered in the hands of the State authorities, in- dent is directed to take "prompt and effectual measures" stead of being transferred and concentrated here. All to have the road made from one end of the United States agree that the patronage of the President is great, as it to the other. I beg to know what measures he is to take. now is; and I know of none, who avowedly advocate its I cannot see; the bill does not tell us. Yet they are to be

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Buffalo and New Orleans Road.

[APRIL 13, 1830.

"prompt," and such as shall be "effectual." We are to present road? In either way, the company's charter would pass the bill into a law; it is not to be controlled-its ope- be virtually repealed-a resort would be made to Virginia rations must not be stopped-the work must go on, regard- to maintain those vested rights which she had given-and, less alike of States, corporations, and individuals. A road let me tell gentlemen, she would maintain them. But, supmust be had by some means. But how? It is easy to make pose all other parts of this road should be completed, and one on paper; but what is to be the process in practice and the turnpikes not interfered with, then they might conreality It is time to think of things as they are and will tinue to be in very inferior condition, while their owners be in fact. Can the President do any thing that we may would receive an enormous amount of tolls, in consequence choose to direct him, without our providing any of the or- of the general improvement of the road. dinary means? Let me ask gentlemen how he will manage to condemn the lands of individuals for this road? How is he to call a jury to assess damages? Not a syllable do we find on this subject. All is to be done by the fiat of the President, who is to go on, it would seem, and take the property without judge or jury. But the commissioners, forsooth, are to make contracts with the owners of the lands. This is all very well, as far as it goes-but how far is that? It is said that the road will be about fifteen hundred miles long-and does any practical man suppose that the commissioners will be able to find all the owners of the various tracts of land over which the road ought to run? Most of the owners are, doubtless, near to the route of the road; but who can tell where many others may be in different parts of the Union, and in other parts of the world? If, however, they could all be found, I would next inquire who they are, and what powers they have to make the contracts desired. Many of them, probably, would be laboring under some legal disability, of infancy, or coverture, or insanity. Some of these difficulties might be obviated; but others might be absolutely insurmountable. Of those who could be found, and would be capable of making contracts, there might be some inclined to charge exorbitant damages, and especially when no means were provided for condemning the land at a fair price.

None of these consequences could be tolerated; and every gentleman will perceive at once how desirable it would be to have those charters modified to suit the oceasion, as to the kind of road and the rate of tolls. But how could it be done? The General Government has no right to grant such ebarters, and, of course, none to modify them. The power to do so is not only omitted in the constitution, but it was expressly proposed in the convention, and positively refused. Such a refusal to grant power has always been regarded as conclusive against its exercise, in the opinion of every sound expositor of the constitution. I am aware, sir, that this argument, as applied to various parts of the proceedings of the convention, militates against the power of the General Government over the subject of roads, far more than is necessary for my present purpose, which is to show that this Government cannot interfere with these road charters, and that the State Go vernments must be resorted to for such a purpose. I would persuade gentlemen to leave the adjustment of these turnpike charters to the State legislatures that made them, and could modify them, according to such un derstandings with the companies as might be easily obtained, with the means at command, if those legislatures had the management of the road. There is a clause in the proposed amendment, to save the rights of these corporations, and to give opportunity for an adjustment of them, beneficial to all; but no such provision either is or can be in the bill, on the principles involved in making the road by this Government.

The terms of this bill would require of the President to do that which it might be impossible for him to perform, and would, probably, accumulate difficulties and expenses utterly intolerable. But those which I have just suggested would all be removed at once by adopting the amendment. If the plan of the amendment be so decidedly preferaThe State authorities are in the habit, as occasion may re-ble on the great points of jurisdiction, patronage, econo quire, of condemning the lands of any person whatever my, the rights of individuals and of corporations, I would for the purposes of roads, and of paying the fair value, ask why it ought not to be adopted? Will any gentleman without being imposed on-and they would exercise the say that it is not a practical plan! Why not? If any power for this road, as in any other case. It might be State has a right now to make a road, in its own territory, useful for the commissioners, as far as practicable, to re- where this Government desires one, as well as any where ceive from the owners, respectively, such statements, in else, surely the right or power to do so will not be dimiwriting, as would show the amount of damages which nished by the aid of money from this Government; and, as they would be willing to receive; and those statements, as far as the respective States might be willing to perform far as they were reasonable, would be data for the State the work, it is morally certain that it would be well done authorities. in a reasonable time.

The claims of individual owners of land, however, are I have occasionally heard it suggested, however, that not all that must be adjusted on this road. Turnpike com- some one or more of the States might not be willing to panies have rights of peculiar and embarrassing character. accept of the proposition, and parts of the road might not How many there may be on the whole route, I do not know, be made. In the first place, I would say, if the whole but enough to make fact supersede speculation, as there road would be worth the money advanced, part of it ought are certainly some at important places in the State of Vir- to be worth its proportional share. As to the residue ginia on the route proposed in the bill, at and near the of the road, I would ask the objector this plain question, Blue Ridge and the Alleghany mountain. Have gentle- if he is prepared to vote for making it, by the direct acmen examined the extent of the duties and rights of these tion of this Government, through any State of this Union, companies, what they are bound to perform, how much that might be opposed to the exercise of such a power i they have expended, and what exactions they may make? If there be any such politician here, I would suggest to It might be well to reflect, too, that Virginia has a standing him with how much greater plausibility he could urge law for the State to subscribe part of the stock in such companies-two-fifths, I think, after individuals shall have taken three-fifths-and I am well informed that she has such an interest in some of the very turnpikes to which I allude. Their roads are not in conformity with the one proposed, and, in some respects, may be very inferior. Of course, they would not come within the exceptions, or escape the operations of this bill. How is the President to manage these parts of the concern? Shall he fix up an opposition road hard by, at unnecessary and enormous expense? Or shall he assume jurisdiction and control of the

that it was "necessary and proper" to do so, after the refusal of such State to execute the work under a fair proposition from this Government. But, if any State would refuse to accept the money, and make its own part of the road, can it be supposed that the same State would quietly acquiesce in its being done by this Government? The chances are certainly the other way, and I speak, in some degree, advisedly on this point. In this view of the matter, sustained by facts which cannot be overlooked, I ask gentlemen, who really desire this road, to reflect on the choice which it will be most prudent for them to

APRIL 13, 1830.]

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Buffalo and New Orleans Road.

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make. On which side lies the probability of success? | road might be retarded by having it done under State au! And on which the strongest appreliension of danger? thority, and that the President might begin the work unTo pass such a bill as that now under consideration der the bill before the legislatures could act on the subject, would be nothing less, sir, than invoking a direct collision so as to make a material difference as to time, I have prowith some of the States of this Union. Have gentlemen cured authentic information to remove such an apprehenforgot the quarters from which we have been admonished sion. If any gentleman supposes that this work would not to exercise this power? Or are they determined to push be done in either way, in a few months, or even years, he on to extremities, regardless of the admonitions, and with- is much mistaken; and it is proper to know the truth on out necessity? If they "love power and forget right," this point, whatever may be the effect. For that purpose, let them at least remember prudence. Sir, I will name I beg leave to read a note which I have received from the no other State than my own-and I admit that her legis- Engineer Department. lature has not been entirely uniform in its resolutions; but "TOPOGRAPHICAL BUREAU, my colleagues cannot have forgot that the very last one it adopted on this subject, denies, most emphatically and unequivocally, the power assumed in this bill. Tennessee did right to deny it, sir; and it will be for her to determine when occasion may require her to maintain the position. As the constitution of this Union now stands, she ought never to surrender the jurisdiction and control of her roads to any Government on earth.

I am willing that this Government shall always exercise fully and perfectly its lawful authority; but more than that I cannot knowingly either assume or agree to, without #detracting from those rights which belong to that State which has been my home through life. However much I may love the true Government of this Union, I yet have a stronger attachment to that of my own State. I take pride in the name of American, but I glory more in the name of Tennessean.

This General Government is well while acting as outposts to guard and defend our liberties; but my State is an important apartment in the citadel itself; and to that I am to retire in the last extremity, whenever the outposts shall yield to a foreign force, or shall turn themselves, and become assailants.

In the politics of this great Federal Republic, Tennessee is my first love, and my last hope!

March 29, 1830.

SIR: In answer to Mr. Lea's letter of the 25th instant, which you referred to me, I have the honor to state, that, taking into consideration the distance, the necessity that the level should accompany the compass throughout, the time lost by Sundays, wet weather, and accidents, the usual average of miles per day in doing such work in the field, in which a sufficient number of details will have to be collected to form a correct basis for estimates and plans of construction, and the usual time required in composing the drawings of the survey and the reports, and that there may be but three parties employed on the entire distance between Buffalo and New Orleans, I do not think it would be safe to estimate, for the completion of this labor, less time than two years.

Very respectfully, your obedient servant,

JOHN J. ABERT, Lieutenant Col. and T. E.

Gen. GRATIOT, Chief Engineer U.S. A.” From this letter it appears that, with three companies of commissioners, the surveys and estimates would require two years. The bill proposes but one company; and so, I presume, it would be six years before the work would begin, as the whole would have to be first survey

to be amended, so as to allow three companies. It seems to me that it might be better to have more. Why not a dozen? The money would be scattered along the road so much the sooner; and that, after all, I take to be the most persuasive argument in favor of the nationality of this and other roads. I hope, however, that the surveys might be completed in time for the legislatures of 1832 to act on the

I call on the friends of harmony and good order, gene-ed. It is said, however, that, in this particular, the bill is rally, to beware. I show them a plan of conciliation—a way in which the object may be attained, without sending our President on the Quixotic adventure of a tournament with some of the States. I am not disposed to engage the President of my choice in any such unnecessary and hazardous business. His enemies may do so, if they choose. I ask gentlemen why they are so pertinaciously opposed to altering this bill. There must be something more in-subject. volved than the particular road in question. They go for I have a few words to say concerning the kind of road principle, forsooth; but they ought to remember that contemplated. It will be observed that my amendment others, also, have some regard for principle, and cannot adopts the same kind, and same price, proposed in the go with their neighbors beyond certain bounds, while bill. I was desirous that the principle should be fairly those neighbors have no necessity for going so far. They tested, and was unwilling that the amendment should carcontend for the right of this Government to make roads, ry heavier weight in the race. But I would not, thereand seem determined to exercise it, even without necessi- fore, have it understood that I am satisfied with that sort ty, and in defiance of the supposed rights of others. It of road or that price. No, the inequality is too great. might be well for gentlemen not to forget the moral of our While others are to have railroads, and Macadamized own revolutionary struggle. Great Britain contended for roads, with stone aqueducts and magnificent bridges, 1 principle, and insisted on the right of taxation. She would want something better for my country than a mudpike and not listen to the remonstrances of the colonies. She corduroy causeways. The refinement of some gentlemen claimed the right, and would exercise it. Nor would she here perhaps may not apprehend the meaning of these be admonished by the fable of the madnian, who would terms, but no matter-I can assure them that we of the shear the wolf, simply because he claimed the right to do backwoods have experienced enough to understand them 30. Some gentlemen seem to think lightly of any oppo- perfectly. My people are poor, I admit; and gentlesition to their career; but let me tell them, that no com- men seem to take it for granted that they will be thankmunity of freemen will patiently endure to be continually ful for small favors. Fifteen hundred dollars a mile, at intruded upon, when they believe that every intrusion tends most! And this is to pay for all damages to land, for grato affect, and eventually to destroy, their rights and liber-duating and shaping the road, for materials, for gravelling ties. While those, who feel their own power, are display- where necessary, and for making culverts and bridges! ing it wantonly and tauntingly, they are sometimes but little aware of the consequences of their own conduct. And if a majority are determined to force this bill through, I wash my hands of it, and shall be under no obligation to maintain the usurpation.

Lest any one should suppose that the completion of the

How can any gentleman believe that such a sum will answer all these purposes? It is not half enough to do the work as it ought to be; and less than three thousand dollars a mile ought never to have been proposed, if a good road was intended, even of second rate. Yet, the gentleman from Virginia [Mr. MERCER] has said that, if he had

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been on the Committee on Roads and Canals, he would not have been willing to report the bill with more than a thousand dollars a mile, as that was as much as we ought to have, and that fifteen hundred dollars a mile was very extravagant, indeed! And this, too, is from the same gentleman, (but not the only one,) who stated that gentlemen from other quarters ought to vote for this bill, to show their liberality and generosity towards the West! I will not deny that I feel indignant when I hear such insulting mockery. In one breath we are told that the road will enrich the country, and, in the next, that a few dollars will make it.

I have another objection to this bill. It neither makes any provision for the preservation of the road, after it shall have been made, nor gives us any intimation of the mode that is to be hereafter resorted to for that purpose. If this road is to be made, I wish to understand the whole concern, from the beginning. Are we to have appropriations made from year to year? Or shall we hereafter establish a system of toll gates? Or will a surrender be made to the States? I ask gentlemen to tell us, if they please, which of these modes is to be adopted. Are they afraid to do so? I am afraid to risk it without. This physic, which is to cure the body politic, may be vitally dangerous, if we take it thus in broken doses. Sir, the manner in which this measure and its policy is to operate hereafter, is of its essence at present. If any gentleman is opposed to annual appropriations, how can he know but that mode may be adopted? If any one is in favor of a surrender to the States, has he any assurance that it will be done? If another is adverse to a toll gate system, by this Government, as most odious and dangerous, has he not evidence enough before his eyes to make him fear that this will be the favorite plan? How many are prepared to leap in the dark? Sir, if I had no other objection to this bill, I would scoru to vote for it with such deception stamped on its face. You offer me a road for the benefit of my people; and what then? You fix a system of tolls at what rate you please, and send your federal officers there to collect them in the federal courts, from any body and every body, if you choose, without regard to persons or business And these tolls, for any thing we know, may be applied to making roads in other parts of the Union. Sir, I desire the Legislature of Tennessee to judge of the tolls which her citizens are to pay within her borders; and, with that precaution, they will never complain of moderate tolls to keep up the road after it shall have been made.

[APRIL 13, 1830.

that it cannot afterwards exercise jurisdiction over them, so as to keep them in repair. It would seem to be a pity, indeed, that a fine road should have to be abandoned to chance as soon as made. This concession is full of argu ment in favor of all the views which I have presented, and must lead that gentleman to adopt them, if he will preserve his own consistency. Let the powers to make and to preserve be in the same Government.

I have endeavored to give a practical view of the bill, and of the contemplated amendment, in relation both to the making and the preservation of this road. I have compared the two plaus, on the points of jurisdiction, patronage, and economy; the condemnation of lands and the rights of turnpike companies; practicability and probability of success; the time of execution, and kind of road; tolls and repairs. In exercising my own opinion, I cannot doubt that the amendment is decidedly preferable, in every particular wherein it differs from the bill; but every gentleman will judge and decide for himself, and I have done with this comparison.

I beg leave now to make a few remarks concerning the route of this road; but I am sensible that it would be a waste of time to detain the committee long on this point, after so much has been so ably urged concerning it by others. In estimating the general as well as comparative importance of the road, I think gentleman have gone to extremes on both sides. But I confess that my knowledge is very limited indeed as to the part of the road from this city to Buffalo; and, I must, in some degree, follow the example of others, by attending chiefly to my own end of it. These two projects, which have heretofore been separate, are this year linked together. Ooe gentleman gets up and tells us all about the ways from here to Buffalo; but as to the other end of the concern, he knows very little. Another can make us a speech for hours concerning the various routes from here to NewOrleans, while he admits that he scarcely knows any thing of the opposite end. Thus we see that the interests and motives connected with the one, have no sort of natural association with the other. And yet these two oppo sites are united in the same picture, a horse's head and fish's tail."

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How is it, then, from here to New Orleans? What is the best route?

It is said that more people will be accommodated by either the middle or southern route, than by the western. I admit that it must be so, if you take either the southern I invite attention particularly to the provisions of the or middle route, and give to it all the people east of the amendment in relation to tolls, as containing a plan quite Blue Ridge; but if you divide them, and give to each of practical and safe. The commissioners, who will have so those routes only its own share, then, I suppose, neither much else to do with this matter, and will therefore be would have more than properly belongs to the western able to perform this duty to great advantage, are, first, to route at this time. We ought, however, to look to the report a rate of tolls to the President. He will have the future; and I have no doubt that, by the time the road different reports compared and made uniform, profiting could be completed, the population to be accommodated by the suggestions of all, before he gives his sanction. The by the western would exceed that of either of the other State Legislatures are afterwards to judge of these tolls, routes, and, in time, might be nearly or quite equal to as a part of the proposition for them to accept. Approved both of the others. But the people on the western route by the commissioners, the President, and the State Legis- would be more accommodated, in proportion to their latures, these tolls may be collected from any part of the numbers, whatever that might be, than the people east of road, as soon as it may be fit for use, and shall be entirely the Blue Ridge, for various reasons. The western route applied to the preservation and improvement of the road. lies through a newer country, in which it is natural to supThey will also be uniform, and cannot be changed, without pose that the roads are not as good as in an older one, if all the assent of Congress, so that no State may impose unrea- other things were equal. The southern country also is nasonable tolls, or speculate on any other. What better plan turally more advantageous for common roads, though less for repairing the road can any gentleman devise or desire? so for making well improved ones; and thus, while the And why might it not be adopted at once, and thus pre-western route labors under great disadvantages at present, vent all future controversies on this part of the subject? This Government would have the use of the road, toll free; and what more could it desire?

One of my honorable colleagues, [Mr. ISACKS] for whom I have much respect, seems to "halt between two opinions," and while he contends most manfully for the power of this Government to make roads, nevertheless admits

and would, of course, be proportionally benefited, it presents greater facilities for making a first rate road. The western route would afford greater accommodatious, moreover, on account of the great land carriage of merchandise, which has long existed and must continue, from the cities north of this place, along that route as far as Alabams. If this road were made south of the Blue Ridge,

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it has not been pretended that it would be used for such a purpose, as merchandise would continue to pass coastwise, by water, to the southern ports, and thence, by rivers and roads, into the interior. But it has been said that the road would answer well in the South, for carrying surplus productions to the navigable rivers. If such neighborhood nationality is to be regarded in this case, it would answer a similar purpose on the western route, perhaps to a greater extent. The western route would be fairly commercial, from this vicinity to Alabama; but no southern route would be so regarded.

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suit the faney or purposes of that gentleman thus unjustly to tear laurels from the brows of brave men; but I am unwilling to tarnish the reputation of even an enemy, by such a ridiculous and wanton error. It is matter of history, notorious to the very schoolboys of the country, that Commodore Patterson spiked those very cannon, when he was compelled to abandon his position; and yet he is to be charged with the high criminality of neglecting his duty to do so, and the British colonel with the gross blunder of not turning one of them on his adversary, and the countervailing measures of the American commander-inchief are to be forgotten. Even if that gentleman has such a desire, he need not expect thus to extinguish or darken the glories of that day.

If the comparison of routes, which others have made more at large, and I have briefly presented, be not very erroneous, (and I think it will puzzle gentlemen to show that it is so in any particular,) then the inference is easy, that the western route is preferable to any southern route, on all the three great points of commerce, war, and the mail.

I have given you some of my views on the best mode and the best route for making this road, and it remains to inquire whether it ought to be made in any way.

There are two aspects of this part of the subject. In the one, the particular measure may be looked to as a means for promoting the efficient action of this Government in its own legitimate operations. In the other, it may be regarded as part of a system of raising and disbursing money.

For military purposes, I cannot see that a southern route would afford any very valuable facility. The natural course for supplies of troops and provisions is from the upper country to the seaboard, and not parallel with it, at a very respectful distance in the interior. That chivalry which really belongs to the South, would not, I am persuaded, recognise this as a military road, which would not lead towards the enemy. But how would the western route be in a military point of view? From the Tennessee line, upper Virginia might send down supplies of troops and provisions, inferior to none, even to this place, or to others more south, by obliquing in that direction from various points. Southwest from the same Tennessee line, the road would lead directly to that part of the Union most exposed and most needing assistance; and this is true of any branch which may be selected, of the westeru route. But it has been said that our rivers supersede the necessity of this part of the road. It cannot be denied that they do, to some extent; and that our rivers must always be relied on as our principal channels for throwing The first view of it is strictly governmental, which I military aid to the defence of the Gulf frontier, as well as take to be the true meaning of the term national, as apfor commercial purposes; and if they were properly implied to these subjects, as well as to all others under the proved and connected, the road would be of comparative action of this Government, whose powers extend only to ly less value, but would continue to furnish important ad- the means "necessary and proper" to accomplish certain ditional facilities, in connexion with the rivers, and, some- specified objects, with a view to general consequences. times, as a substitute for them. We ought to look to the uses which this Government, as As to the mail, it is admitted by all that the advantages such, (and not any portion of the community,) may have would be great on any of the routes. I argue, however, for a particular work, to determine its character. It is that the advantages on the western route would be great-national or not, as this Government may or may not have est, because the southern roads are now better than the western, and most would be gained by making improve ment where most needed, especially where the means are better for making it permanent. How much might be saved in transporting the mail is uncertain, as well as the other benefits from expedition; and every gentleman must conjecture and calculate for himself. I have not considered it important to make a particular comparison of distances, not regarding the differences as great enough to influence materially the final decision.

use for it, in as much as the States and people can know nothing of this aggregate nation, except through the action of the General Government, in which alone consists the identity or nationality of this Union itself. If a work is desired for such purposes, the extent of it is entirely indifferent, and the whole of a long road used for governmental purposes is no more national than any part of it used in the same way, as a large ship of the navy is no more national than a small one. The inquiries, then, ought to be: First. What use will the Government have for the work? Second. Has it a right to apply money to such purposes? Third. Will its advantages be equal to its expenditure? All private or local concerns are out of the question, and every gentleman should put it to his conscience to determine the case without regard to them; and, at the same time, with an eye single to the particular measure in question, as standing on its own intrinsic merits. Where the advantages of this Government, in all its legitimate operations, could be fairly estimated as worth more than the interest of the money, it might be difficult to show that it would not be a judicious, permanent investiture. Whether this bill presents such a case, depends on calculations of economy and security, which every gentleman must make for himself, in connexion with the ultimate extent of the work and the manner of its execution. Whenever these shall have been ascertained and fixed, then the means will be at hand for a final decision.

When viewing this road in its military aspect, the gentleman from Virginia [Mr. MERCER] adverted to some circumstances as connected with the defence of New Orleans. I omitted to notice his remarks in mine under the same head, and I would not now stop to retrace my steps for the purpose of setting him right, if I did not think part of what he said was too unnecessary and inaccurate, in the best view of it, to let it pass without some reply. That gentleman took occasion to step out of his way, it seemed to me, for the purpose of giving us a fact which happens to be no fact; and an opinion based on that unfortunate foundation, that if Colonel Thornton, who commanded the British forces on the opposite side of the Mississippi from New Orleans, had not been guilty of one of the grossest military blunders, the American forces on this side of the river must have been driven from their entrenchments, and compelled to retreat to the city, with all the consequences. That gross blunder was in not Having said thus much of the road as a strictly governturning against our troops, on this side of the river, some mental measure, and abstracted from others, permit me of the cannon which had fallen into the British colonel's now to notice it as part of a system of raising and dishands, at the post necessarily abandoned by Commodore bursing money. It has not been, and will not be, denied, Patterson, when a single piece thus turned would have that it is the policy of many gentlemen to raise a great accomplished the overthrow just mentioned. Sir, it may revenue for the purpose of expending, and to devise

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